AND.carry what YOU are comfortable and accurate with. Chris Bartocci on a YouTube video explains why MARSOC went away from this 1911. WebAs shown in Fig. Ive hunted with both 9 and 45. Just one article about that here: http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2015/07/08/u-s-military-makes-monumental-shift-hollowpoint-pistol-ammunition/. He sure has screwed us military retires over the last several years! I checked him out, and he's legit as far as that title is concerned and where he works. I like all of them. But why not? Sit back and take a deep breath and pray that if I am ever involved in a use of force criminal trial, pray like mad that this Marine is NOT called as an Expert Witness because I do not think there is enough toilet paper in a courthouse to clean up the mess this guy is going to make from his testimony. 9mm and 45 ACP are popular for all the reasons listed above. Come join the discussion about optics, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! 158 gr 0.38" Special plain lead bullet will generally not exit from a human body. A 1911 in 9MM? The .223 weighs in at 55 grains, while the .22 is usually 45 grains or smaller. A more accurate equation is (terminal) Energy, defined as 1/2 the mass times the velocity squared. Select the option or tab named Internet Options (Internet Explorer), Options (Firefox), Preferences (Safari) or Settings (Chrome). How does air resistance have ANYTHING to do with the terminal ballistics as they relate to penetration? Looks like a Chinese-made toy gun. Damage: 55. .45 Magazine type M1911 mag.45 ACP: Damage 1389 Blood: Fire modes Semi Shots to kill body: 3 head: 1 Effective range 50/100 m Rate of fire moderate Recoil Moderat Noise Moderate I can say with great certainty that many animals dont just simply fall over and die. All the scientific debates the fact is both are great but its interesting to me as a marine my understanding that the 45 was developed for the jungle warfare against drugged up Muslim extremist in the Philippines inthat timeframe and then fast forward to Falluja drugged up Muslims extremist And everybody Marines wanted 45 again In real situations Where it matters most I just wrote my friend who is in the thick of - and Falluja lost an arm multiple casualties and his answer was quick and simple 45. Its disturbing to me that we give up performance for comfort. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. It is extremely difficult to shoot accurately under such pressure. There are other similar handgun calibers, such as the .44 Special and the .45 Colt, and of course, the .357 SIG and 10mm Auto are Has the Marine Corp's choice to transition from 45 ACP to 9mm duty pistols settled the debate on which caliber is better? Now for long engagements that are seen more in military ops and where fire suppression matters most I prefer 9mm. I just bought a S&W M&P 9 Shield. Sad. The projectile is losing velocity and arcing downward. We have came a long ways with jackets, cores and construction of bullets in the last 50 + years. The argument about effectiveness, capacity, reliability, stopping power, etc has been going on as long as I remember, ad nauseum. You could smell the gunpowder. Very smart Chris ! Wounding one enemy combatant to take three out of the fight (or at least two) was a good argument when we were facing civilized enemies such as the Germans in WW II. Yes, Im another old Viet Nam Vet. I am at a loss for words as I read the above two paragraphs like literally at a loss for words. According to a sweeping 2016 survey, there were, at that time, more guns in the hands of Americans than there are cars on the road. Leave it to a bunch of idiot Marines to bring a pistol to a rifle fight. Better get that imagination under control, tough guy! Why bullet size matters in police shootings | PoliceOne.com The amount of energy deposited in the body by a bullet is approximately equivalent to being hit with a baseball.. Patrick points out that there is sufficient oxygen in the brain to support voluntary, life-threatening actions against an officer for 10 to 15 seconds after the heart has been destroyed. I am older now, living in the city. All this scientific garbage really sounds great, but if you need fifteen rounds to eliminate a threat you got real bad aiming habits. The objective of this study was to construct a If these shootings have something in common, it is each and every one is different. Thats because the 7.62 is almost twice as massive as a .223. Thats good, it is always good for people to find what works best for them. As might be expected, larger-diameter bullets produce more devastating wound cavities and have a greater likelihood of striking vital organs. Obama wants us dead. How about a test sample of exactly the same bullet weight in a high impact L.E. The .223 generates a far larger shock wave, and penetrates farther, than the .22. Seems to me that American businesses take it in the chin enough already without this insult. The new .50Ae desert eagle has as much recoil as the 1911/M45 which is unrealistc (the .45 has alot less recoil). Circulatory collapse will result in significant deprivation of oxygen to the brain. Hit your enemy Quickly and Hes Dead. Cpl. Our only requirement is that you give Ammo.com appropriate credit by linking to the original article. Very accurate and deadly, The bullet travels at 1450 FPS. 3, both hemolymph ACP and AKP activities of P. clarkii were significantly decreased in the 30 and 50 mg/L groups compared to the control (P < 0.01).Similarly, PO activity also exhibited a significant reduction in the 30 mg/L group (P < 0.05) and the 50 mg/L group (P < 0.01), respectively.However, LZM activity showed a significant increase This remained the norm in the FBI until May 2014. Or 45 cal quickly changes the perspective f the individual. The one magor factor that keeps deciding the outcome is if the victim or assailant has the actual ability to kill. Thats just because most folks never have to shoot someone firing at them. In my book Lethal Force and the Objectively Reasonable Officer, I point out that after the FBI shootout in Miami, the FBI Firearms Training Unit, under the leadership of Unit Chief John Hall, tested 9mm, 10mm and .45 caliber rounds. Most rounds fired do not hit anyone at all. That still dont make them experts but better than the average person. And It will get the job done quite handily. American troops in the Philippines discovered this important distinction in the late 19th century. He became an FBI agent and served in the FBI for 30 years, retiring in the position of supervisory special agent/chief division counsel. Our team, our mission, our partners, and more. The one that traveled the furthest was looking back over its shoulder and was hit in the muzzle. Just as in the case of the military, my agencies biggest determining factors for this decision were not anything to do with the performance of the rounds or the effectiveness for the safety of the officer. If you have been hit with any kind of bullet large, fast, expanding, or otherwise please fill out our survey about your experience after being shot. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); 2023 Concealed Carry Inc. All Rights Reserved. This was not a good CC carry eather so for a while I did not carry CC. The bullet had disintegrated his spleen and torn his aorta. Makes no difference to me. Both are great bullets, but not really comparable. It enables struggling shooters to attain better weapon control/shot placement, and permits skilled shooters to be faster and more accurate. Train, train train and when your done. They said, ja, the 9mm kills people just fine, as long as you use it the way anyone with any sense uses a pistol caliber. Project: Aftermath Wiki. Also SOCOM has been using hollowpoint ammunition for years, but primarily against unsanctioned terrorist personnel. to stop the threat. The kidneys separate this material from the blood. In his 1989 treatise, Handgun Wounding Factors and Effectiveness, Supervisory Special Agent Urey Patrick explained that the goal of an officer in a life-threatening shooting incident is to incapacitate the adversary as quickly as possible. I was a PA-C in the military. Most of these wanna be gangsters are cowards and are used to shooting at people who dont have guns to shoot back. I have never personally tested 9mm long range, but I have seen 45 Auto results. As someone just coming in your home or coming at you out of the blue. 2.1 and 2.5 million defensive gun uses annually, Law Enforcement Assistance Administration, Arming Yourself: A Woman's Guide to Self Defense and Concealed Carry (CCW), Protecting Your Family: A Parent's Guide to Self Defense and Concealed Carry (CCW), Arming the Elderly: A Self-Defense Guide for Senior Citizens, Holsters for Self Defense: A Guide to Carrying Concealed, Arming Toddlers and The "Kinder-Guardians" Program: A Shamefully Bad Idea, Self Defense for LGBT: Self-Protection and Concealed Carry (CCW) for the LGBT Community, Arming the Disabled: A Self-Defense and Concealed Carry Guide for People With Disabilities. You get Into a real shooting scenario. Browse our site today and place your order with confidence. Im no expert but i know how it feels to be in a shoot out, first of all when it goes down you better have some kind of firearm i dont care if its a P shooter, 2nd the person will be placed in a situation where they will have to make a business decision when here a pop coming from you. Nobody I know whos been in the service liked the M9. Using the right bullet is where it counts. If we had had 45acp in the hands of the FBI in most every one of these complete inept foul ups they would likely have never happened and the debate would only be Glock or 1911 45 acp. quick defense trigger and has an extended 17rnd clip. All this newer powder and more efficient bullets. What makes the .223 potentially deadlier than the .22 is its velocity. Ive been training for 50+ years and continue to do so. Ultimately, your selection of a caliber should be based first on the penetration, and second on the unexpanded size of the round. PS: I forgot to mention that as a SAW gunner I was allowed to carry an old .45 (Springfield Armory). One other thought dont ever modify the trigger on your self-defensive gun if you ever have to use it in those situations and lawyer finds that out he will own everything you have. With that in mind The most lead I can force through the air, the better. I am not old. I like to shoot three-four people a weektime permitting, of course. WebIn real life the tissue damage of the .45 compared to the 9mm is much more and ingame atm the difference is minimal. , Hodgkinson was armed with a rifle that shot 7.62 caliber bullets. I also could not afford the astronomical price (astronomical in my current budget) shops are now asking for a 4 inch Ruger Redhawk. I am not sure why Ruger did not enter a weapon into the competition (like the new American pistol), but it could be that they looked at the RFP and made a determination that for some reason their pistols didnt fit the bill, or perhaps they decided it wasnt worth it. Mr. Im sorry, but the .50 Barrett sucks there is no match grade ammo available for it. I dont have a dog in that race but it is important to give proper information, not just anything that will satisfy your viewpoint no matter how erroneous. We had competant and caring armorers and shooting instructors ( These guys gave a fuck and went out of their way for you ). The bullet that struck U.S. Representative Steve Scalise last week was traveling at somewhere between 1,100 and 2,600 feet per second. According to mamas statement, Papa got crazy and chased her into the bath room. Just how common are self-defense uses of firearms? I dont want a light fast bullet that will over penetrate and possibly injure or kill an unintended.
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